1- Joseph Smith 26
12 – James Talmage 6
11 – Restoration of Priesthood Authority 22
2 – Continuing Revelation 10
3 – The Doctrine and Covenants 28
7 – The 1st Official Declaration 4
4 – Temple Building 24
9 – The Young Women’s Program 8
In today’s matches:
2 – Brigham Young vs. 11 – Hugh Nibley
3 – Physical Divine Beings vs. 10 – Tithing and Consecration
4 – The Pearl of Great Price vs. 8 – The 2nd Official Declaration
1 – The Welfare Program vs. 12 – The Young Men’s Program
Vote and comment below!
23 Replies to “March Mormon Doctrine Madness, Round Two Day Two”
Tithing and Consecration
Hugh? You pick Hugh Nibley over Brigham Young? Wow. Just, wow.
John, I disagree with all your picks except PoGP.
I agree with Hugh as a pick. Most of Brigham Young’s theology has been abandoned at this point, whereas Nibley’s readings of the Book of Mormon continue to influence FARMS researchers and therefore, indirectly, Mormon intellectuals.
What! You think the PoGP has more impact than the 2nd Declaration, which, if I remember correctly, extended the priesthood to every male?
Who reads the PoGP? And for what? I mean except for figure 7 on the hypocephalus…
What can I say? In terms of relative influence, I go Emma > Hugh > Brigham (for many of the reasons that RT mentioned).
But now I am curious. Why is the 2nd Official Declaration winning over the PoGP? I appreciate you guys making Eric doubly wrong, but this is just weird. Explain yourselves.
Mogget, we must have been typing at the same time.
I read the PGoP (although not as much as I’d like). There’s some pretty important stuff in there.
Ah, well, I’m thinking more on it now. There’s some interesting stuff, but I guess my time with the NT has convinced me that there’s “interesting” and then there’s “Interesting.” I gotta go teach Institute, but when I get back I’ll go into what I’m thinking about in more detail.
I don’t know about the Pearl of Great Price’s influence. The Joseph Smith/History bit is fine, and influential, but it’s really just a fragment from a larger and more influential story available in better form elsewhere. The Articles of Faith are memorized and then disregarded, and evidently didn’t really even reflect Joseph Smith’s current thinking at the time he wrote them. Joseph Smith/Matthew is great for fans of the apocalypse, but that theme is far less salient now than at perhaps any other moment in Mormon history. The Book of Abraham is perhaps a bit sketchy in effect, if not in substance; I think it’s probably the only element in the current standard works that de-converts more people than it converts. The Book of Moses, then, is what we’re mainly left with. Does that have a major theological impact on Mormonism? I’m not sure. Some impact, certainly. But probably not as much as the fact that we can do missionary work in Africa, Brazil, and the Carribbean.
PoGP includes the Articles of Faith and JSH-1 — both of which are highly influential in the church today (not to mention Moses and Abraham). It should win, IMO.
Brigham should beat Hugh in the voting too. Despite the fact that we have abandoned some of his theology, his no-nonsense pragmatic personality is still revered and emulated in the church today. The Church reflects Brigham’s personality more than Joseph’s in many ways. (Hugh was great, but he actually insisted we live the law of consecration now and nobody seems to take that idea seriously…)
What is more important, PoGP or OD 2?
Can you even imagine asking that question in Brazil or Africa? I’ll take millions of converts since 1978 over facsimile # 2 anyday.
The result that is astonishing to me is that YM is winning over the welfare program.
What I think of as the YM program (scouts, camping, service projects) hardly even exists outside of the U.S. and Canada. The welfare program is recognizable throughout the world, and has influence on hundreds of thousands of people who are not of our faith.
Mark, the welfare program is actually not terribly recognizable in many parts of the world. That’s one reason I picked YM.
I voted welfare, but primarily because I think the perpetual education fund falls under that heading.
While I agreee with you that the church retains BY’s pragmatic approach, I voted for HN because he changed the way we think of the Book of Mormon.
Well, RT has kinda captured my thoughts on the PoGP. The central element of Christianity–that salvation comes through Jesus–was never lost and so did not require restoration. The PoGP, as also the BoM, has interesting information, but nothing to compare with the NT.
well i was tempted to come back to the blog after receiving a slue of emails about some old posts of mine, but after reading the above, my desire has once again evaporated. This discussion: 1) focuses on nonsense issues, and 2) reeks of apostate influences. Sorry John, I tried, but it’s just not for me.
How anybody can read “Zion – A Distant View” and think that Hugh Nibley influences the thinking of the members and the function of the church is just crazy. Yeah, he was a smart guy, but his most important idea, that money corrupts and keeps us from being a Zion people, is contrary to everything the modern church recognizes as valuable. For Pete’s sake, they bought a mall.
Brigham Young’s teachings formed the basis of two years of PH/RS lessons less than ten years ago. As an adult convert, I was a member of the church for over ten years before I ever heard of Hugh Nibley.
Today’s conservative, Puritan, follow the prophet focus has Brigham Young’s fingerprints all over it.
100 years from now, Hugh Nibley will be a minor footnote. 100 years from now, everybody will still know who Brigham Young was and what he did.
PofGP because that’s where most folks go when they need a proof-text for pre-mortal life, which is ubiquitous in Mormonism.
Good points, Ann. I too think that most Mormons should read “A Distant View” and take it to heart. Mine is terribly marked up with exclamation points, underlinings, highlightings, etc. Love it, love it, love it.
Well Ann, call me crazy, but I still go with HN.
Six or seven decades ago, the Book of Mormon wasn’t studied or discussed. Heber J. Grant didn’t think it was all that important. With the publication of Lehi in the Desert and The World of the Jaredites, Nibley required us to consider the BoM as a legitimate focus of study. That goes not just for academic study, but for the rank and file member’s daily scripture study as well.
I can hardly stand it! I’m sooo tempted to vote for Brigham again just to tie things up.
Mark IV, you’re crazy 🙂
The Book of Mormon is important today not because of Hugh Nibley, but because of Ezra Taft Benson.
Dead on, Ann!