Sunday AM Session Open Thread: Where We Learn That FlipFlops and not secularists are undermining morality.

Two more to go.

Please play nice. Disagreement is allowed. Rude is not.

I really enjoyed the Priesthood session. I am looking forward to the rest of Conference.

78 Replies to “Sunday AM Session Open Thread: Where We Learn That FlipFlops and not secularists are undermining morality.”

  1. There have been a lot of President Benson references. I think this is partially because he focus on the idea of worldly evil. I do not agree with much of what he said, but there was also a lot of good stuff.

  2. For some reason, I had the impression that the mayor was from Taiwan–the comment about “harmony and prosperity” seemed to back that up. But I could be wrong.

  3. I do not think the idea of agency leads to a libertarian view of all things. In a way, many of the arguments for marriage are friendly towards the idea of marriage for all.

  4. Because the Church has moved away from the notion that sex is only for conception, I think we need to abandon the whole “power of procreation” rhetoric. From now on we should call it the “power of love.”

  5. I’ve had the thought that, since we no longer maintain that birth control is wrong, it’s time to abandon the teaching that “delaying” child-bearing is necessarily wrong.

  6. 1. Any relationship that aren’t in line with the teachings of the gospel are wrong.
    2. The gospel teaches that we should be married in the temple.
    3. All non-temple marriages are wrong.

  7. The Proclamation can be defined as revelation…possibly even canon at least according to the author of this article on the White Horse Prophecy:

    In this article, he shares that lds canon is put forth by first, the prophet introducing a revelation, then the quorom of the 12 voting in favor, and finally, bringing it forth for the church for a vote….hmm…now that I think about it I think Hinckley read the Proclamation in Relief Society meeting and it wasn’t voted on. Therefore, it can be defined as revelation, but not canon, or scripture.

    What do ya’ll think?

  8. Hard to believe that this wouldn’t pass as canon: “We, the First Presidency and the Council of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, solemnly proclaim that marriage…”

  9. #46 Oaks is actually pretty cool in person. He came and visited our stake a month or so ago. He had a meeting with us where he let loose and kind of had an “open mic” discussion. He’s actually a funny and congenial guy. I had only seen him in conference and was under the impression he was very stern and legalistic…his conference talks are always so serious. It was refreshing to see his real personality.

  10. #48 The Proclamation wasn’t brought forth though for a vote for the church to accept it as scripture so therefore it’s not canon.

  11. what? you expect our church leaders to study biblical scholarship. thats evil intellectualism.

    I have wondered alot lately what the priesthood is. Is it really anything tangible and real like metachlorians or something. It seems to me that all miracles and power of God comes from faith independent of priesthood.

    Priesthood seems to just be hierarchy or an almost corporate label in actual practice

  12. Joseph Smith didn’t need to say those things in the 1840s. I admit that it reads like a committee wrote it – but perhaps I mean it is bold in the JS sense.

  13. When I ushered for one of the Mission Presidents meetings at the MTC, Pres. Packer talked a bit about the creation of the Proclamation to the Family and how inspired its creation was. He talked about how every word was carefully reviewed by the brethren and that the process was so involved that even the amount of syllables and the intonation of each word was taken into account. The line “this word has too many syllables, this one not the right intonation,” lingers in my memory.

    I’m not making any cases, just reporting.

  14. #74, Well, that kind of careful attention to the number of syllables and intonation is simply good writing style. But it does indicate that the Brethren wanted the material to stand out as something important.

    I suppose it is good to know that the Brethren carefully reviewed it, otherwise I might consider the decision to support Prop 8 to be merely the influence of one or two apostles.

  15. In response to #42. The author of that poor article also states that Theodore Turley was a faithful member of the church until his death. Well, he was actually excommunicated around the time the White Horse prophecy was recorded. He had mercury poisoning and was certifiably crazy, claiming visions and revelations on behalf of the church. Probably shouldn’t rely on that author…

  16. Yikes–I find it deeply distressing that anyone would approve of the prose style of the Proclamation. It’s ugly bureaucratic boilerplate. Prophets should write poetry (like Isaiah(s), Jeremiah, even Mormon and Moroni sometimes…).

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